Transcript of 4/1/03 Interview: Randy Watters-- Bill Bowen

 

Hi, I’m Randy Watters, I’m here to interview Bill Bowen of Silentlambs, website www.silentlambs.org. He’s been in the news a lot lately. And how are you doing Bill?

 

Bill: Doing very well.

 

Randy: Very good. What is Silentlambs, Bill?

 

Bill: Silentlambs is a non-profit organization dedicated to giving support to Jehovah’s witness victims of child abuse. We primarily try to support those who who were molested as children when they were Jehovah’s Witnesses. We realize some people have left the organization and some people are staying within the organization. But that makes no difference to Silentlambs. We try to help these individuals to be able to report molesters to police; to help them to be able to deal in the congregation with issues with identifying this to other members of the congregation. As well as knowing how to proceed legally if they have issues that need to know how to prosecute or educate themselves about child molestation issues. How to identify if a child has been molested as well as how to help people. With regard to counseling and things like that, with problems in that area.

 

Randy: So that brings the question: Why are you here today?

 

Bill: Well, the reason I’m talking to you is because I think that child abuse is an issue that transcends any organization, that transcends any effort, and  a number of people come to your website have been molested. As a matter of fact, according to information that I’ve been given, you are one of the first people that had information about child abuse within the Jehovah’s Witnesses on the internet. And so this helped a lot of people be aware that there’s a problem.  I think Silentlambs has taken it a step further to help people identify specific ways that they can address that and be proactive when it comes to these issues. So I appreciate the efforts of anyone who identifies this as a problem and help victims—abuse survivors—to get the proper suport that they need.

 

Randy: What is it you have on your lap here?

 

Bill: Well, this is what we call the Silentlambs lambs. We have used these, you might say, around the world., to bring creedence to the issue of innocence lost of those who have been molested in the organization. We have delivered a lamb to the branch in Germany, the branch in England, the branch in Denmark, as well as numerous Kingdom Halls across the United States. We delivered over five hundred lambs to the home office in New York. And the sole purpose of all these lambs being delivered is, for victims that could not be there, that could not speak, these lambs were of significance to them. This means they were there, because this lamb represented them.

 

Randy: Now, a lot of people have never heard of this issue and they might say: “Who is Bill Bowen, I’ve never heard of him .” But actually there has been some media coverage that you’ve had so far.

 

Bill: Well, we’ve had documentaries that have been shot and ran in over eight different countires around the world concerning Jehovah’s Witnesses and child abuse. We’ve aired these documentaries in over thirty countries around the world. We’ve carried our stories on CNN, Dateline here in the United States; we’ve also had articles in Newsweek magazine, we’ve had three articles in Christianity Today; as well as several hundred AP and newspaper articles that have highlighted stories of abuse survivors across the United States and several other countries in the world.

 

Randy: That’s incredible Bill. Lately in the news there’s been a lot about the Catholic pedophile issue. Is this related to that, exactly the same? Are they somewhat similar, or what/

 

Bill: Well, the Catholics, their problems relate primarily to Catholic priests, who had molested—typically—little boys. Jehovah’s Witnesses’ problems are far more reaching, in that it deals with ALL their membership, who molested primarily little girls. So, that being the case, it is a more far-reaching problem, and more pervasive, as compared to the Catholic scandal. The Jehovah’s Witness’ scandal is much larger and has a much worse proportion.

 

Randy: Do you anticipate the media coverage getting more building up as momentum, or what?

 

Bill: I think we’re into a different phase. Inittialyy, we were trying to get the public to recognize that there was a problem and educate them about that. Now we’re in a phase where we’re actually putting a tire to the road in which we’re going to the courts and proving through the laws of this land that jehovah’s witness’ policy hurts children. And so we want to show before judges that this policy has to change in order to protect the children. Jehovah’s witness leadership—the Governing Body—and those that support them, say that there’s nothing wrong with their policy. They say that I’m a liar; and the six thousand victims that have came forward, they’re all liars also., and there’s nothing to these stories. Well, on the Silentlambs website, there’s over a thousand stories of abuse posted there. Are those people all lying? That’s what Watchtower would have you believe. And so, the next step is to prove who the liars are.

 

Randy: So that answers my other question; someone might say that you’re just a trouble, why don’t you allow Watchtower to go through the normal process. And you’ve had many many testimonies of people who have tried to work it out through the Watchtower, but it hasn’t happened. Is that correct?

 

Bill: Well, I was one of those people. I worked for almost a year in what you call the ‘Theocratic Arrangement’ as an elder, who had a fellow elder in my congregation who was a child molester. And the options I was given at the end, was that he could tell the congregation that he was no longer an elder for whatever reason he chose to gave, which was not true. We could not inform his wife; no one else in the congregation could be informed; nor could the police be informed, that he was a child molester. So, from that point forward, my purpose was to educate other people about this issue. And I have found many many elders that come to me and said that exactly the same thing happened to them. So, this was not an isolated occurance in the state of Kentucky. It’s an occurance that’s happening around the world as we speak. And that’s why this policy has to change.

 

Randy: Now, from the beginning, I know that I’ve been following your efforts and been advertising it on my website among other people. Even on my own guestlog I see quite a number of people who have detailed their stories of molestation and abuse. And I can vouch for the fact that there are thousands of people out there who are ready to testify on these issues. So I can certainly relate to that. What are the latest court developments that have come about as a result of your work.

 

Bill: To date, in the last two years we’ve had fourteen lawsuits, civil lawsusits that have been filed against the Watchtower Socity specifically citing them for negligence in their policy in how they handle child abuse.

 

Randy: And this started about …

 

Bill: Started approximately in June of the year two thousand and one. So it’s actually a little less than two years. We’re in the process this year, we should file a little more than a hundred more lawsuits that have filed negligence on the Watchtower Society and how they have handled child abuse.

 

Randy: Amazing. Now, people will say “Well, this is probably a problem in mnay mainstream religions, you’re singling out Jehovah’s Witnesses.” But how do Jehovah’s Witnesses compare to other mainstream religions. Is this the problem that’s going to happen in any mainstream religion if the media gets ahold of it or what?

 

Bill: I think it’s interesting to note that J.R.Brown has quoted to the media that –he’s the media spokesman for the Watchtower—he said that “Jehovah’s Witnesses are no worse than mainstream religion when it comes to the problem of child abuse. Well, if they’re no worse then I wouldn’t be sitting here today. And there wouldn’t be those stories posted on the website. Jehovah’s Witnesses are far worse than mainstream religion when it comes to child abuse. If you tok a thousand Catholics and a thousand Jehovah’s Witnesses you would have far more children molested in that group of Jehovah’s Witnesses than you would in the Catholics. And far more cases of it not being reported to police. Why do I make that assumption? Because of the policy. The policy of Jehovah’s Witnesses says elders must investigate. That investigation taints the police investigation and often times prevents molestation from being reported. No other religion does that, and practices it on such a worldwide scale and authorizes through Brooklyn New York the way Jehovah’s Witnesses do. So fo rthose reasons, you could give that as basic reasons, that’s why I think it’s worse.

 

Randy: Do you think Jehovah’s Witnesses, or the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is a more closed Society and does that perhaps contribute to the problem?

 

Bill: Well, Jehovah’s Witnesses use the Scriptures , 1 John 5:19 that says ‘the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one.” So that means anything or anyone that’s not related to jehovah’s Witnesses’ organization itself is part of Satan’s world. So if you go to an elder with a problem, then you’re going to Jehovah for help. If you go to a policeman or a judge, then you’re really going to Satan’s world for assistance. For those reasons, typically most brothers and sisters, because of that nature of their belief, what they’re going to do is cause them to stay within the organization and not go to the world for assistance.

 

Randy: Now how have you seen the Watchtower respond to this in terms of their magazines? I know the Watchtower magazine is their main publication. Have they printed anything or warned their people or asked them to go to the police. What has been their response so far to the court cases and to tour efforts. Do they even acknowledge you as an individual?

 

Bill: I think most Jehovah’s Witnesses are familiar with Silentlambs due to the media coverage and newspaper articles written on this. The response of the Watchtower Society: I’ve heard many reports of circuit overseers giving talks in which they say that the information in the media is distortions of the truth, false stories, or outright lies. And so the belief put forward to the Witnesses typically is, that this information is completely false; it’s not to be believed; and this is some form of persecution from Satan for trying to just protect children.

 

Randy: Now one of the most interesting things I think about this is: The Watchtower policy against those who criticize them or oppose them is not to acknowledge them and to kind of warn around them. I mean, I was at Bethel Watchtower Headquarters from 1974 to 1980 and I left and I publicized –I was actually the first one to publicize what happened a yeare before Ray Franz wrote his book ‘Crisis of Conscience’ and that’s how I got started. But they’ve never acknowledged me as an individual; they’ve never acknowledged Ray Franz specifically in their magazines; and they probably haven’t acknowledged you by name in their magazines, but they’re being forced now to acknowledge your work through your website and especially through the media. Is that correct?

 

Bill: Absolutely.

 

Randy: And that’s a first.

 

Bill: Yes. In repeated articles, such as this article here in the Watchtower—this is March first of the year two thousand and three—they talk specifically about the media and lies and distortions being told. The only thing that’s been reported in the media in the last year is the issue concerning child abuse as far as I’m concerned. That’s the only articles that I have seen.  So while they package this article as persection, comparing it to the Zazi concentration camp, they’re not being persecuted for a matter of faith. They’re being persecuted for raping children and allowing it to go on. That’s not ‘persecution’; that’s called ‘prosecution for negligence.’ So they need to face up that they’ve been negligent, they’ve hurt children, leadership has caused this to happen. This is not persecution, this is prosecution for negligence. So this article in my opinion has no bearing on the issue so they refer to these negative reports in the media as being liars. I don’t think they’re liars.

 

Randy: Now where can people go for the latest information on what’s going on in these court cases. You have a website don’t you?

 

Bill: Yes, the website is www.silentlambs.org.

 

Randy: Now what does ‘org’ mean?

 

Bill: ‘Org’ is a non-profit organization. Every penny that goes into silentlambs goes to support and help abuse survivors. I take no profit whatsoever from the organization. As a matter of fact, I take a lot of money out of my back pocket to keep things going as far as Silentlambs is concerned. Silentlambs is dedicated as an organization to helping abuse survivors to speak out to the media and to prosecute child molesters. We feel that when abuse survivors speak out they take positive steps on the path to healing. When they stay quiet, they slowly but surely burn themselves up inside. As one abuse survivor told me, “if you try and go around the problem, the problem gets bigger and bigger and bigger.” The only way you heal is to face it straight down the middle. When you face it down the middle, then you start to heal. So, I’m not a counselor, I’m not a therapist, but I think this is the wisest counsel I could give anyone that faces abuse: “Face the problem, speak out about it, report the molester;” and then you’re going to start to get better, and you’re going to protect other children in the process.

 

Randy: So you’re just an average guy, and you’re not even drawing an income from this, you’re out there spending your own money, and doing this, people can’t accuse you of making money off of this. Did you have any big bones to pick with the Watchtower before this happened, or do you have a vendetta against them before you came across this issue?

 

Bill: I was a second-generation Jehovah’s Witness, active in the organization for over fourty-three years, almost twenty years as an elder, I served in virtually every management and administrative position in the organization; I was a ‘company’ man. I had no axe to grind against Jehovah’s Witnesses. The purpose of Silentlambs is not to challenge the organization, their doctirne or beliefs. We simply ask them to protect their children. If Jehovah’s witnesses do what we ask, the children will be protected. Silentlambs will continue to function as a support group for abuse survivors and not an educational website to instruct people about how Watchtower policy works. We’d be tickled to death to make that change.

 

Randy: Now, were you known as a trouble-maker before this whole issue of the pedophiles and child abuse came up? Do you have a record with the Watchtower where they could just write you off?

 

Bill: In a word: NO! I mean, why would they use me. I managed at the conventions, I was in the parking departments, and they used me extensively for talks and thing sof that nature. If I was a trouble-maker, why would they use me in all these positions? So, like I said, I did believe according to the theology of the organization; a spiritual man should stand for what is right--what is Biblically, morally, and ethically right. And I was able to work within the arrangement up untill the point the organization said that they would put a child in danger. I could not morally and ethically support that position any longer.

 

Randy: So would you say that your main gripe against the Watchtower was not against their theology, but rather against the moral issues involved and their failure to comply with the morality of humankind and the morality of the country—the world in fact?

 

Bill: I fully believe that Jehovah’s Witnesses have the right to practice their religion as they see fit. The first amendment of this country guarantees the freedom of the exercise of religion. And I don’t want to take that freedom away from anyone. On the other hand religion---whether it be Jehovah’s Witnesses or any other religion—do not have the right to want children to be raped and do nothing about it. So this religion, Jehovah’s Witnesses, whether they wish to face it or not, are allowing children to be raped and not taking the best action that should be taken. Now to be the cleanest people on earth, to raise yourself to the standard that’s higher than other religions that should be part that you should focus on as the highest priority. Your children are your future. If you’re allowing them to be hurt or putting them in danger, there’s something morally, ethically wrong here, that has to change.

 

Randy: Now that brings up an interesting issue. You said earlier that media spokesmen for the Watchtower said recently, that we’re no worse than any other religion. Yet you just mentioned that they set themselves up as morally higher than other religions. Obviously there’s a contradiction in there.

 

Bill: I think you need to ask J.R.Brown about that.

 

Randy: Okay, we hope to do that. Now what do you think needs to happen to protect children in the community; in the JW community or in the world at large.

 

Bill: We’re not asking any Jehovah’s Witnesses to stop attending the Kingdom Hall. We’re not asking any Jehovah’s Witnesses to stop going into the preaching work. All we’re asking for is the organization to do three things in the interest of protecting children. Number one: if a child is molested, report it to the police first and let them conduct a proper investigation. Number two: if a man has molested children within the organization, he should never have positions of responsibility. The Service Department current policy is, that after twenty years he can requalify.

 

Randy: Wait, you’re saying that a person who is known to have been involved in a child molestation can actually not only  continue as an active Jehovah’s Witness in good standing, but could in time become an elder again?

 

Bill: Absolutely. He not only can become an elder again, but he will remain anonymous as he moves from congregation to congregation; he will not be identified as a child molester if he has not been reaccused after twenty years. That should change. It should be ‘forever’. In this world, if you’ve molested children you should never be appointed as an elder again. And there are elders serving right now, within the organization, who have confessed to molesting children twenty years ago and they’ve been reappointed again. Now that should change.

 

Randy: That should change.

 

Bill: The third area is, is child molesters should not be allowed to go in the door-to-door activity. They are a danger to the community, and they are a danger to the Witnesses who work with them because they do not know, often as not, that they are child molesters. If they want to wear a badge that says ‘repentant child molester’ then so be it, they can go dor-to-dor and let the public decide whehter or not they want to talk to him or not. But otherwise, these people should find other ways to do the preaching work. Not in the public with the door-to-dor ministry.

 

Randy: So you’re saying, that right as we speak, at this moment, there are most likely Jehovah’s Witnesses going door-to-door who are child molestrers, whether they’ve been convicted oor not, and people at the door are totally unaware of that.

 

Bill: Not only are the people at the door unaware of it, but often as not the Jehovah’s witnesses working with them are unaware because there are privacy issues of confidentiality in the congregation.

 

Randy: What would you recommend to the person who has a Jehovah’s Witness coming to their door, and the Jehovah’s Witness started talking about their ‘clean’ organization, and how different it is from other society’s; what would you recommend that householder to say to the Jehovah’s Witness?

 

Bill: We would just say we would encourage them to educate themselves about their child abuse policy; educate yourselves about it and then work for change to protect your children. That’s what I’d encourage them to do.

 

Randy: And what has been the Watchtower response to court cases; you mentioned that there has been quite a few court cases and quite a few more coming up. What’s been the response of the Watchtower to this?

 

Bill: For me personally, that’s been the most disappointing aspect of the leadership of the organization. Because they have embarked on some of the most horrid and perverse ways to humiliate these victims that come forward with these abuse allegations and negligence. I talked to an abuse survivor who’s involved in one of these suits and the Watchtower Society requested every report card that this young girl had had from school. They wanted every medical record that she had ever had, they wanted all her psychology reports. They then asked her to recall every single time that she was molested; the time of day that it occurred, what actually happened on that occasion, and the actual damage that occurred to her mentally on that occasion when she was molested; and write down each one of these on a piece of paper which was to the tune of hundreds of occasions.

 

Randy: Good grief, now that would be—some Witnesses would say, ‘That’s got to be an isolated case; now obviously in a big organization, six million people, you’re going to have some elders and some Witnesses that don’t follow the rules; isn’t that just an isolated situation?”

 

Bill: No, this is what they’re requiring of the victim, as a way to intimidate them. Watchtower goes into a community, they hire the top shelf law firm; and then they proceed to start filing hundreds of motions to win—not legally—to win based on draining the lawyer defending this child of the resources financially; to answer hundreds and hundreds of motions that are filed on frivolous things. And so in the end, therse top-shelf law firms are being paid by Watchtower to the tune of thousands of dollars; are trying to prevent this from ever coming to court. These cases were filed in June of two thousand and one, and they have fought it every step pf the way, with every type of underhanded legal tactic to prevent this from ever seeing the light of a jury investigation. The last ruling, which was in the newspaper, which stated the judge says that the Society was negligent in the way this was handled, and it was going to trial, which was a huge victory after filing numerous if not hundreds of motions to prevent this from ever getting to this point. So we’re getting to an area here, where they’re not going to be able to legally maneuver to get out of it being faced. But what it is, here you have a young person that’s been deeply damaged by negligence; instead of apologizing and doing the Christian thing and saying “Look, how can we help you, can we settle, can we provide you with some compensation to pay for therapy and the things that you need?” Instead, they say ‘We’re going to humiliate you and punish you so that no one will ever come against us in court about child abuse.”

 

Randy: So if I was a female Jehovah’s Witness, and someone had sexually abused me, or even a male Jehovah’s Witness that’s been sexually abused by someone in the congregation; you’re sayign that if I were to go to the elders, or especially if I were to go to the police, that they would come after me an dharrass me and possible even disfellowship me?

 

Bill: Well that’s more or less a separate issue. What I was talking about was a case that was being litigated, the civil cases that are being litigated in court. But on a separate issue, if you go to the elders and you report the abuse; it’s been stated ina May twenty-fourth letter that they would never prevent anyone from reporting the matter to the police. The point of contention is, if you tell anyone else in the congregation. Then you start being punished. So yeah, you can go to the police, they’re not going to say anything about that. But if you try to warn anyone else in the congregation; or you tell anyone, “This is the reason my child is hurting,” or “This is the reason they’re sick,” if you try to make any explanation then you can be branded as a slanderer, you can be disfellowshiped, and you will face sanction. Then when you go to court, often as not, if the elders have determined that this molester is an innocent man, you’re not going to receive any cooperation or help in the congregation. They’re not going to help you. Because the elders have said that he’s innocent. If he’s innocent, why would you go to court against an innocent man?

 

Randy: One side point I might mention is, J.R. Brown, media spokesperson for the Watchtower, has said that they consistently follow the biblical mandate of having two witnesses or two or three witnesses to a situation like this. Do you consider that legitimate, or is there a big flaw in that response to the situation?

 

Bill: J.R. Brown and the leadership of the organization committed themselves to stating “it’s their policy to have two eyewitnesses to cases of child molestation.”

 

Randy: Why is that so unrealistic?

 

Bill: In just about any other judicial proceeding in the organization that is seldom, if ever, required. If you are branded as an apostate, typically or not, two eyewitnesses will not be required. If a woman spends the night with a man under improper circumstances, for more than six hours, you don’t need two eyewitnesses to confirm that there was adultery committed. She’ll be disfellowshiped for being with a man under improper circumstances. So if an adult is with a child under improper circumstances, they say “Oh, you gotta have two eyewitnesses before that can be proved.

 

Randy: And that’s not likely to happen.

 

Bill: No, no molester will ask for somebody to watch unless that other person is a pervert themselves. And they certainly aren’t going to testify on the child’s behalf. So, it creates a circumstance where for a  child it’s virtually impossible for them to prove their case if the molester denies that anything happened. And ninety-nine percent of all child molesters deny that anything happened.

 

Randy: Of course. Well let me ask you this, Bill; what has been the response to you personally by Watchtower and others?

 

Bill: Well, I have many brothers and sisters who call me and says “Thank you; thank you for what you’ve done, thank you for bringing this issue out, because it needed to be.” Those people are typically people whose children have been molested and they’re appreciative of the efforts I’ve put forward. On the other hand, many Jehovah’s Witnesses who are following what they’ve been told in the magazines; they’ve sent me threatening emails, I’ve had death threats, I’ve had threats of physical harm; since I’ve spoke out on this issue they’ve basically asked the brothers and sisters that have worked with me in my business to quit; they instructed all the brothers and sisters that have purchased candles from me in my business to all stop, so we lost about a third of my business; they sent a substitute circuit overseer to the congregation to give a special ‘local needs’ part. He got up on the platform and he says “the person that went to the media has spoken against God; all these allegations are false, and everyone that’s been doing this is a liar”. Which is incredible. It’s a lie. Also when I went to the meetings, they treated me as though I was disfellowshiped.

 

Randy: Even though you weren’t disfellowshiped?

 

Bill: No, when I walked in, no one would speak to me, I would get sour looks, when I woud raise my hand to comment they would not call me, no one would call on me. And I would ask the elders and they would say ‘Oh, you’re welcome to raise your hand, you’re not breaking the Scriptures,” but they had told everyone not to call on me.

 

Randy: How did they inform everyone, by the podium?

 

Bill: Yeah, everyone that had a part onstage, they said “not to call on Bill,”

 

Randy: They would do that privately or in front of the congregation?

 

Bill: They would do that privately. Because everytime I would ask them they would lie, and basically say “Well, you can comment all you want to. We’re not going to prevent you from raising your hand.”

 

Randy: That’s absolutely amazing.

 

Bill: And when I would meet for field service, they would put me in a car group by myself, with no territory.

 

Randy: Oh, my gosh.

 

Bill: And when I asked to work with a group, they would say, “Well no one wants to work with you, but they didn’t ask if anyone wanted to work with me. And they told me it was going to be that way untill further notice. And when I finally confronted the elder body about the fact they were  starting to use the molester again for exemplary priviliges in the congregation, I told them, I said ‘It offends me, it offends the victim that you would start using this person again. And they told me that “the most offensive people take offense”. So, in so many words, they were saying that me and the victim were more offensive than the molester himself. He remains a Jehovah’s Witness in good standing, he remains protected by the congregation; and the latest comment to the media was, this was last week when a reporter interviewed an elder. They said that “The allegations were proven to be false and that they did not have a molester in the congregation.” Their own records show that this man confessed to molesting children. So they lied to the media in my opinion. I don’t know what you’d  call it anything else. They continue to tell this story when they well know this man is a confessed child molester. And they continue to protect him with this type of misinformation, about why he’s gone.

 

Randy: That’s absolutley amazing. You know, I admire you Bill, for sacrificing as much as you have, and your wife, just to let this message be known. If people want to get in touch with you, you have a phone number; I know you have a website, www.silentlambs.org; what’s an email and a phone number they can reach you?

 

Bill: We have a hot line, its 877WatchtowerAbuse; WTABUSE;

 

Randy: And that’s toll-free?

 

Bill: That’s toll-free. There’s no charge for making the phone call. And that answers to a hot line, we’ll be glad to return your call if you make that reference. Or you can email me directly at info@silentlambs.org.  And I’ll be glad to help anyone that is dealing with abuse issues, or to be able to find a way to report molesters, anything that is within the framework of supporting silentlambs. One thing I’ll point out, is that this work will go forward because we’re telling the truth. There’s no reason to lie about this. This is the truth.

 

Randy: You’ve got nothing to gain from this?

 

Bill: If anything, I would have been better off from a purely prestigious standpoint to keep my mouth shut. I was presiding overseer.

 

Randy: And nobody asked you to step down before you brought this issue up.

 

Bill: Absolutely not. I resigned of my own volition. If I would want to keep my authority in the congregation, I should have just kept my mouth shut and let a child continue to be molested. And then I could have been an elder to this day. I could not do that. It was morally and ethically wrong. The result is, that child is now in a protected environment and the molester has no access to her anymore. So, all this work, is because of one child. So ultimatley, we’ll protect thousands of children, because we stood up for one person. And all these other victims that have come forward will protect hundreds and thosuands of more children, because they already know that this issue is real as a result.

 

Randy: Bill, it’s been a pleasure. Thank you for the interview.